TM1 Forum

We are currently running TM1 version 9.1 SP3 with 5 concurrent licenses. Recently, the number of TM1 users have increased in the business and there are currently 15 users. At the moment, I am managing the users by,

1. priority
2. time frame and/or
3. connecting and disconnecting using macro for once of users

However, the number of cube explorers are increasing and soon I will need more licenses. To get a permanent solution, we contacted IBM a few days back and got told that apparently very recently IBM has stopped the co-existence of concurrent and named licenses and reviewed the pricing again. So, looks like we have to now get 15 named licenses (roughly @5K) which seems to be very expensive.

Not sure if we should pay the expense now or wait till IBM completes the development of its new TM1 look alike product called Cognos Express.

Any suggestion will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

There is a conversion ratio to go from concurrent users to named users, I have heard this ratio quoted at anything from 1:2 to 1:5 (market and customer dependent) but the last I heard was that the ratio had settled on 1:3 which should get you your 15 users (for fairly minimal conversion fee).

If you need more than 15 users then I would think it might start getting expensive as you would then be paying per user. Also consider whether you really need Contributor licenses (with write back), read only licenses are generally cheaper .... provided they are still being sold ...

Rashed wrote:We are currently running TM1 version 9.1 SP3 with 5 concurrent licenses. Recently, the number of TM1 users have increased in the business and there are currently 15 users. {Snip}
However, the number of cube explorers are increasing and soon I will need more licenses. To get a permanent solution, we contacted IBM a few days back and got told that apparently very recently IBM has stopped the co-existence of concurrent and named licenses

Yes, this is nothing new; it was planned even before Cognos bought Applix. My rep contacted me at the time that they (Applix, as was) had changed to the named user model. He said that that if we wanted to buy more concurrent licences it would be our last chance at that time; while they'd continue to support the concurrent licences thereafter, we'd have needed to convert to named user if we wanted to increase the number in the future. I went for the named user since it was better value for us for various reasons. But that was of course under Applix's pricing structure.

Rashed wrote:and reviewed the pricing again.

When you wear a blue suit, I believe that "reviewed" is a euphemism for "increased"

Rashed wrote:So, looks like we have to now get 15 named licenses (roughly @5K) which seems to be very expensive.

Depends. The real price to the business will of course be less once the tax effect (the amount that can be deducted) is taken into account, but yes, I know that in this environment it's hard to get CFOs to sign of on a 75 grand purchase. I referred one of my former colleagues (who had gone to work at another, considerably smaller) business to Iboglix when he asked me who he should talk to about buying TM1, but in the end the cost was, in his words, "about the same as the cost of our whole GL system" and he couldn't justify it.

If you can tie the value that the product adds to the bottom line, it's a no-brainer... but assertions at conference presentations notwithstanding, it's very difficult to be able to quantify the cost or revenue effects that (most) software has on a business.

Rashed wrote:Not sure if we should pay the expense now or wait till IBM completes the development of its new TM1 look alike product called Cognos Express.

Honestly, I hadn't even heard of Cognos Express prior to this post. I Googled it, but could only come across a handful of references, mostly user group or distributor presentations, dating back over the last few months. Colour me surprised that I couldn't find anything about it in the Byzantine melange that passes for IBM's collection of web sites. However I don't think that it's a "look alike" product; from what I've been able to gather it's just TM1 integrated with a version of Cognos BI. My guess is that it probably has some cut down functionality compared to the full-on Cognos BI (which you REALLY don't want to know the price of unless your pockets are deeper than mine), but that would be a guess since the references that I've seen suggest that it's the proverbial "mid market" product.

However the bottom line is that I would be very surprised if "Cognos Express" ended up being a cheaper version of TM1 since it would just cannibalise TM1 sales. That wouldn't make sense.

But then, this is IBM, so who knows.

If you want a lot (not all, but a lot) of the functionality of TM1 but at a much lower price (like, free; well, kinda-sorta), you'd probably be better off looking at Palo. We have a Palo forum here at OLAP Forums as well (just navigate back to the Board Index via the link at the top left and you'll find it), and John Hobson is pretty well versed in the product.

I've always been of the view that Applix (and now IBM/Cognos) made a huuuuge mistake in not chasing after "entry level" customers for TM1, and that's what's really left the door open for Palo. However for a "mission critical" application, especially for larger companies, you may be better sticking with a larger supplier (Iboglix) which can give you support when you need it.

I'm not saying that you SHOULD switch (I like having TI, for example), but it's another avenue to explore. Much will depend on your individual circumstances; shelling out for TM1 will be better for some, going Palo will be better for others.

However for a "mission critical" application, especially for larger companies, you may be better sticking with a larger supplier (Iboglix) which can give you support when you need it.

Ahem.

According to Mr Pendse smaller vendors perform significantly better in support than larger ones. In his survey

13.4% of Large vendors customers (902 respondents) scored them as having "Excellent Accurate and Timely Support" compared to 41.5% for small vendors (607 respondents). Go figure whatyou are getting for your 25%

There seems to be a supposition in that post Alan that because IBM is big it will be better (is someone else hijacking your ID????) . Comments on this forum seem to indicate that because it's big it is more complex, but I have seen very little evidence of any significant product development in terms of functionality over the last 2 years and assume that any energy expended here is being directed at integration.

If you want a lot (not all, but a lot) of the functionality of TM1 but at a much lower price

And of course, if you want an Undo Spread

John Hobson wrote:

However for a "mission critical" application, especially for larger companies, you may be better sticking with a larger supplier (Iboglix) which can give you support when you need it.

Ahem.

According to Mr Pendse smaller vendors perform significantly better in support than larger ones. In his survey

13.4% of Large vendors customers (902 respondents) scored them as having "Excellent Accurate and Timely Support" compared to 41.5% for small vendors (607 respondents). Go figure whatyou are getting for your 25%

There seems to be a supposition in that post Alan that because IBM is big it will be better (is someone else hijacking your ID????) .

I make no judgement on this point, thankfully not having needed critical assistance since the Great 8.2.10 / 8.2.11 Upgrade Disaster, when Applix was still at the helm.

However I think it has to be conceded that IBM will undoubtedly have more resources to throw at a problem than a smaller competitor... whether it does so in an effective fashion is something that users must judge for themselves and/or on the basis of posted experiences.

That is, once they finally get their ICN and are registered as the primary contact, right, The Two Steves?

You might consider taking a look at the "TM1 Midmarket edition" as well.

This is very competively priced. It has several advantages over buying new concurrent licenses:

- you can switch to 64 bit wo additional cost
- you get TM1web (EV as well I think) included in the package


I have a customer who wanted additional licenses + move to 64 bit. The price for this in the old model is about the same as the price he would pay for a brand new TM1 Midmarket Edition. But in this scenario he also gets TM1Web "for free" and the maintenance is a lot lower.

Thanks to you all for your valuable suggestions. It helps a lot.

It looks like Mid Market edition is the best option given the scenario we have. Even with Mid Market, the cost is much higher than what we are currently paying. It will be a huge challenge for me to convince the management for this big jump in expense considering we are only benefiting from only a few extra licenses ignoring the free EV which we hardly will be using since all the models are excel based.

It is also worth looking at other products, e.g. Palo. But again, not sure how much work is involved in converting the models from TM1 to Palo.

Rashed wrote:It is also worth looking at other products, e.g. Palo. But again, not sure how much work is involved in converting the models from TM1 to Palo.

Lemmie check what the time is in Lytham... Oh, OK, 03:59; you might need to wait a few hours for an answer to that one.

Well it's 7.44 now Alan

not sure how much work is involved in converting the models from TM1 to Palo.

Very little - The structural design is the same (give or take the discussions around architecture and object locking that I have been reading, but if you have a basic model your cubes and dims will be pretty much identical)

If you can get your head around the problem ( ) of converting say elcomp() in your rules to palo.echild you will be well on your way.

It's really not very stretching at all (and I imagine that that is no coincidence) .

Worth a look at least if cash is an issue.

Thanks again John. I am not sure if I am asking a lot, but would ask it anyway.. ...whats the best material to read to get started with Palo?

Ask away that's why we come here

whats the best material to read to get started with Palo?

Weeeeeelll.....

I think I'd start with the manual

You do have to pay 30 Euros for that but it is worth it.

There is also some basic "about Palo" material on the Jedox web site. (www.jedox.com)

If you have any specific questions you can post them in the Palo are of this web site.

Thanks John. Just so that I got the freedom of asking loads of questions...I hope you dont mind me asking a few now....

1. Can Palo link to TM1 view to load data instead of reloading them from warehouse and/or operational systems?
2. I read a thread about Palo unable to do C: level rules? is there any workaround for this apart from excel based formulas?
3. Any known differences in capabilities of TI and Palo ETL tool?
4. Can I load the full Palo architecture (Worksheet, ETL and OLAP Servers) in one Machine? I guess would be great to minimize the hardware requirements as much as possible (being a small company we always keep an eye on resources)

Thanks in advance.

1. Can Palo link to TM1 view to load data instead of reloading them from warehouse and/or operational systems?

I'm not quite sure what you are asking here, but you could for example do a palo.setdata (equivalent of DBS) from a spreadsheet, although the two add-ins don't co-exist totally happily.

It would be more sensible to squirt out an ascii file from TM1 and import it to PALO. If I understand the roadmap, it won't be too long before you will be able to simply read a TM1 cube using Palo anyway.

2. I read a thread about Palo unable to do C: level rules? is there any workaround for this apart from excel based formulas?

Where did you read that. It' s not true anyway. C: level rules work just fine as does spreading (and undo spread )

3. Any known differences in capabilities of TI and Palo ETL tool?

Yup. I have to admit that the ETL tool's lack of GUI means that I prefer TI at the moment. The PALO ETL tool is a programmers toy and not an end user type development tool. They are supposed to be releasing a GUI version "Real Soon Now" .

4. Can I load the full Palo architecture (Worksheet, ETL and OLAP Servers) in one Machine? I guess would be great to minimize the hardware requirements as much as possible (being a small company we always keep an eye on resources)

Well I have it all running on my laptop so the answer is yes.

Probably best to post any further questions in the PALO area Rashed

Thanks John...really appreciate your help. Hope you have a gr8 weekend!!!!!